Trying to make a rig to record onto Sony SL-HF450 Betamax VCR

[KekkyLekky]

I'm into this sort of old tech as a side hobby and am definitely an amateur, and I've been wanting to try out the recording feature of my Sony SL-HF450 Betamax VCR.

I've been trying to make a setup to where I can record my Dish Network (the tuner box for the Dish Network is set to cable channel 73) onto my Sony SL-HF450 Betamax VCR, whose tuner cannot reach channel 73. Here's what I tried to do: Connect the RF Dish Network cable to a VHS VCR that can reach channel 73, connect the VCR to a TV through RF and also connecting the VCR to a Panasonic DMR-ES15 through RCA cable, setting the VCR to VCR mode so that it provides output to the DMR-ES15 while still giving a blurry picture to the TV, connecting the DMR-ES15 to an RF modulator, setting the Betamax VCR and the RF modulator to Channel 3, and connecting the RF modulator to the Betamax VCR through RF.

The problem with this setup is, I cannot seem to get the RF modulator to provide output to the Betamax VCR. Its "on" light does not illuminate, and the level meter on the Betamax VCR is blank (indicating a lack of audio input). I have the RF modulator plugged in. Am I using the RF modulator wrong?

And I cannot simply bypass the RF modulator and connect the DMR-ES15 to the Betamax VCR through RCA cable, because the Betamax VCR can apparently only record audio from RCA input. I tried this and was successfully able to record audio onto a blank Betamax tape (though for some reason, the VCR didn't recognize that the broadcast was stereo, and switching the Beta Hi-Fi switch to "on" made the level meter indicate that the audio input was mono, so I had to use normal audio).

[Electronic M]

I think my main betamax deck at home is the same model. Those beta decks absolutely could record composite audio video input, and that's the best thing to use unless you want to add noise to your picture.

If your sat box has Composite video and audio output just move the beta deck over to the sat box and connect it directly with RCA cables.
If the sat box is RF output only then your probably best off just connecting the composite A/V output of the VHS deck directly to the Betamax.

Things to be aware of: most VCRs and consumer RF modulators do not have stereo audio over the modulated RF even if they have Stereo input they usually Y them together internally and have a mono audio RF modulator.
Early stereo VCRs like that Betamax sometimes didn't have stereo tuners, but even when they did they often supported simulcast audio recording.

Decks with simulcast recording when switched to simulcast mode would record only the video from the tuner and instead of using the tuners audio they would record audio from the line input jacks. Many TV stations lacked stereo broadcast capability for a while but would often own an FM radio station and would use the FM station for audio simulcast during concerts and major events...a user would connect the line output of an FM radio tuner to the line in of the VCR to record the FM simulcast audio.
Most decks that support simulcast will have a record mode switch that will let you choose to record off the tuner, simulcast, or line input .

Your records line audio but won't record video unless it's from the tuner, but without audio issue, sounds like you are in simulcast mode.

[KekkyLekky]

Originally Posted by Electronic M

I think my main betamax deck at home is the same model. Those beta decks absolutely could record composite audio video input, and that's the best thing to use unless you want to add noise to your picture.

If your sat box has Composite video and audio output just move the beta deck over to the sat box and connect it directly with RCA cables.
If the sat box is RF output only then your probably best off just connecting the composite A/V output of the VHS deck directly to the Betamax.

Things to be aware of: most VCRs and consumer RF modulators do not have stereo audio over the modulated RF even if they have Stereo input they usually Y them together internally and have a mono audio RF modulator.
Early stereo VCRs like that Betamax sometimes didn't have stereo tuners, but even when they did they often supported simulcast audio recording.

Decks with simulcast recording when switched to simulcast mode would record only the video from the tuner and instead of using the tuners audio they would record audio from the line input jacks. Many TV stations lacked stereo broadcast capability for a while but would often own an FM radio station and would use the FM station for audio simulcast during concerts and major events...a user would connect the line output of an FM radio tuner to the line in of the VCR to record the FM simulcast audio.
Most decks that support simulcast will have a record mode switch that will let you choose to record off the tuner, simulcast, or line input .

Your records line audio but won't record video unless it's from the tuner, but without audio issue, sounds like you are in simulcast mode.

The "input select" switch on the Betamax VCR has three options: "tuner," "line audio," and "line/PCM." Is "line/PCM" the correct input mode in order to record video and audio via composite?

Edit: Ah, it looks like that's what did the trick. I hooked up the VHS VCR directly to the Betamax VCR via composite and set the input switch to line/PCM, and it successfully recorded video. However, the picture that was recorded appears to have some problems with chroma noise and horizontal jittering. Though perhaps that could be because I viewed the playback without putting it through a TBC.

[Ed in Tx]

Originally Posted by KekkyLekky

The "input select" switch on the Betamax VCR has three options: "tuner," "line audio," and "line/PCM." Is "line/PCM" the correct input mode in order to record video and audio via composite?

The "PCM" was for something like a PCM-F1 digital audio processor among others that used the composite video to record the PCM stream. They probably added a "PCM" label to avoid confusion for someone hooking up a digital processor. Now, that labeling causes confusion.

[KekkyLekky]

Originally Posted by Ed in Tx

The "PCM" was for something like a PCM-F1 digital audio processor among others that used the composite video to record the PCM stream. They probably added a "PCM" label to avoid confusion for someone hooking up a digital processor. Now, that labeling causes confusion.

Yeah, and the owner's manual of the Betamax deck (of which I have a copy) talks about recording through PCM, but it doesn't make any mention of recording general video/audio composite input via the line/PCM input mode. I imagine Sony expected the buyer of the VCR to have also bought other Sony products, such as the PCM that is pictured or a Trinitron TV (the manual even mentions the Trinitron).