Consumer Reports and extended warentees - Videokarma.org TV - Video

vinljnkie · #1 01-14-2013, 08:21 AM

I spent the holidays visiting my parents in FL and my father subscribes to Consumer Reports. I started looking at an issue that was reviewing flat panel TV's and was shocked to see that CU recommends against buying extended warenties on them. They say they tend to be very reliable and its a waste of money. I have always heard just the opposite, if you buy a flat panel TV you better make sure you get the extended warenty for as long a term as you gan get. What do you think?

lnx64 · #2 01-14-2013, 09:56 AM

I generally hate extended warrantees because a lot of them are kinda flakey. But these TV's are seriously un-reliable.

I have had a couple of LCD's, bought new, and they all failed in some way. Usually capacitors, but the backlights (CCFL, not LED), get worn out easily and dim even after a few couple years. CRT's don't get this tired that quickly. And unlike a CRT, you can't just nudge the contrast up a little to get it brighter. Once the CCFL is tired, it's probably already as bright as it can go.

dieseljeep · #3 01-14-2013, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lnx64

I generally hate extended warrantees because a lot of them are kinda flakey. But these TV's are seriously un-reliable.

I have had a couple of LCD's, bought new, and they all failed in some way. Usually capacitors, but the backlights (CCFL, not LED), get worn out easily and dim even after a few couple years. CRT's don't get this tired that quickly. And unlike a CRT, you can't just nudge the contrast up a little to get it brighter. Once the CCFL is tired, it's probably already as bright as it can go.

The old fluorescent lamps won't stay lit, when they get worn out.

bob91343 · #4 01-14-2013, 11:35 AM

Historically, products fail during break-in, and then are reliable until wearout. The insurance outfits make their money on that fact.

I recently had a cell phone problem and they said sure it's covered by our extended warranty. But there is a copayment of $100. Heck I can get a new phone for that. An obvious scam, and I do NOT recommend extended warranties.

I was in the stereo repair business for a number of years and saw these things in a tangible fashion. I even sold extended warranties and was almost ashamed to take the money, since I knew it was mostly profit.

Geoff Bourquin · #5 01-14-2013, 08:00 PM

In the CRT days I always advised people to skip the extended warranty. With the flat sets I'm not so sure about that. Look at what it costs for a mainboard, LCD panel, power supply, or inverters. Any of those will cost more than a couple extra years of coverage (if you can even get the parts!). OK, puked capacitors don't cost much to fix, so the customer might come out behind there. On the other side of the issue, these days people probably would prefer to replace a broken set if it is more than 4-5 years old. Gotta get that 3-D, wi-fi model that does the dishes and washes the car. And in 4 years THAT set will be viewed as obsolete too.

ChrisW6ATV · #6 01-15-2013, 02:41 AM

As Consumer Reports points out, those "warranties" (really, service contracts) cost about the same amount as a typical repair, IF your set is one of the few that end up needing a repair in the specific period of more than one year but before the contract runs out.

AiboPet · #7 01-15-2013, 07:19 AM

I wouldn't.

Electronic equipement mostly fails within a week or two if it's some sort of defect....and would fall WELL within the "take it back to costco". Buy your stuff at Costco if they do have it. You can take something back for a month I guess....even if you simply "don't like it". No matter where you got it though...almost any problem will show up within the standard 90days, 1 year...two years or whatever warranty.

If you are gonna buy a flat set.....stay with LED. do NOT get plasma.....and the thicker sets almost certainly have the flourescent (cold cathode) backlights. Plasma burns in and suffers from decreased brightness(permanent). Older LCD sets will have backlight issues or suffer from "image persistence", especially if you ignore the letterbox or 4:3 bars all the time (not permanent...but a pain to excercise out).

These sets are getting so cheap, that you'll likely not even want to repair one beyond something simple like a few caps. I would consider any warranty really just a waste of money.

CES this year was crazy.....All the majors had these new "4K" sets or "UltraHD". Effectively this resolution is like if you put four 1080 sets together. The funny part? There is ZERO content out there yet for these sets....but they are pushing 'em.

These newer sets are actually becomming quite reliable. One sure sign of this is that the manufacturers are starting to push GIMMICKY stuff like 3D and now UltraHD..... in hopes the public will just HAVE to have it, and replace what they have for really no good reason.

wkand · #8 01-15-2013, 10:58 AM

I have a 3 YO LG Plasma 1080P set from Sears. I bought the warranty which just expired. I felt it was cheap insurance, although I had no trouble. Got the set cheap, ($800) and the warranty cheap (less than $200). I hung it myself, so I saved the install cost, therefore, warranty was free. How do ya like THAT logic?

My other experiences with extended warranties:
Had a Maytag refer bought in 2003. Got a 4 year warranty. The compressor ,of all things, went out just before it expired. Got an $800 repair for $200 in that case. Bought a Mitsubishi VCR in 1998. It went out 1.5 years into the 2 year. Got a free one there too, BUT I'm not as convinced that I made out, since the warranty was $150, and a new VCR was $75 by then. Still have the replacement VCR though, and still use it.

wkand · #9 01-15-2013, 11:31 AM

Oh, and I mustn't forget my 2001 Buick Regal, (off topic, I know) Paid $800 for a 5 year 75,000 mi warranty, (aftermarket, NOT GM). I got $2400 in repairs on that investment....

AiboPet · #10 01-15-2013, 12:16 PM

That would SORTA bring me to the other "not worth it" with an extended warranty.

I won't leave the cars alone.....so I typically tend to void any warranty. This would likely be the case for just about any TV set or laptop as well.

If the dealer opens the bonnet and sees an aftermarket intake, torque dampers, Doug Thorley header, exhaust and catback....short shifter, complete Windows 7 "carputer", they are likely to LAUGH when you come in and point out a little ATF leaking from the transaxle. Same goes for any electronic item I have gotten "into" for any reason at all (usually a laptop). If they can bring up ANY clue that "you messed with it"....than you are kinda SOL, and have wasted money on any extra warrantees.

Of course this doesn't really apply to a more TYPICAL user that isn't going to go in and upgrade their gear or play with any internal adjustments.

I tend to really only purchase things "I" completely understand....and it's sort of a given that if something happens after 90 days. or if I have given in to some urge to modify it, it's MY baby to figure out. I just don't at all get "into" something I feel I won't understand (like my celphone)

Warrantees just make things NOT fun to own for me really, unless it's just an appliance to me.

wkand · #11 01-16-2013, 11:27 AM

I hear you AbioPet, I'm just too old and and my frenemy Arthur Itis prevents me from trying to fix everything anymore, and with parts costing what they do, I "tipped over" into warranties a few years ago on a selective basis.

vinljnkie · #12 01-16-2013, 03:58 PM

I bought an extended warranty on a used car and it paid for $1800 worth of transmission work as well as a rental car for 5 days while it was in the shop. Definitely got my moneys worth out of that one. The company I work for has a 40" Toshiba LCD on the wall in the break room and it runs 24 hours a day at least Monday through Friday and sometimes Saturday as well. It's been there for about 5 years and still works fine. The only TV related problem they have had was when a big wind storm came through and blew the DirectTV dish off the satellite and it took a week to get someone out to re-aim it.

bob91343 · #13 01-16-2013, 04:30 PM

One of the biggest scams is the home warranty. They just won't pay for anything.

Jeffhs · #14 01-16-2013, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AiboPet

I wouldn't.

Electronic equipement mostly fails within a week or two if it's some sort of defect....and would fall WELL within the "take it back to costco". Buy your stuff at Costco if they do have it. You can take something back for a month I guess....even if you simply "don't like it". No matter where you got it though...almost any problem will show up within the standard 90days, 1 year...two years or whatever warranty.

If you are gonna buy a flat set.....stay with LED. do NOT get plasma.....and the thicker sets almost certainly have the flourescent (cold cathode) backlights. Plasma burns in and suffers from decreased brightness(permanent). Older LCD sets will have backlight issues or suffer from "image persistence", especially if you ignore the letterbox or 4:3 bars all the time (not permanent...but a pain to excercise out).

These sets are getting so cheap, that you'll likely not even want to repair one beyond something simple like a few caps. I would consider any warranty really just a waste of money.

CES this year was crazy.....All the majors had these new "4K" sets or "UltraHD". Effectively this resolution is like if you put four 1080 sets together. The funny part? There is ZERO content out there yet for these sets....but they are pushing 'em.

These newer sets are actually becomming quite reliable. One sure sign of this is that the manufacturers are starting to push GIMMICKY stuff like 3D and now UltraHD..... in hopes the public will just HAVE to have it, and replace what they have for really no good reason.

My Insignia 19" flat screen (using LED backlighting), with no gimmicky features whatsoever, is now in the second year of its 2-year warranty. Worked perfectly out of the box and still works very well. I did not buy the four-year extended warranty when I purchased the TV and doubt if I will now, even though Best Buy does offer that option.

Yes, the TV makers these days are in fact promoting the heck out of gimmicks such as 3D, UltraHD and who knows what else may come along, but that's been going on since commercial TV began in this country in the late '40s. Zenith, for example, had a switch on some of its high-end TVs of the '50s that increased the vertical size of the picture. Later, they came out with wired remote control (the Lazy Bones) in 1950, the first wireless remote (FlashMatic) in 1955, Space Phone in some of its high-end sets of the '80s, etc. These were almost always features that did not add much, if anything at all, to the basic functions of the TV (except for remote control, which took off like a rocket in the '50s with Zenith's Space Command, and is now a standard feature of every TV manufactured today). One of Zenith's more memorable ads for Space Phone was the one in which three men were sitting in front of such a TV when it rings -- and the man at the right end of the couch hands the remote to his friend next to him, saying "Hubie, answer the television."

However, Space Phone only lasted a couple model years, then was dropped and was never again added to any other line of Zenith TVs. I had a great-aunt (now long since deceased) who had a Zenith TV with Space Phone, but to the best of my knowledge and belief she never used the SP feature.

Another gimmick that flopped miserably was the disappearing screen found on Zenith's "Space Screen 45" televisions of the early 1980s. The motorized screen rose up from the top of the cabinet when a button was pressed on the remote (this also turned the TV on), and disappeared into the cabinet, also turning off the set, when the power button was pressed again. The gimmick used a very complex motor drive system that wore out or otherwise broke down within a year or two; the sets became so troublesome (even if they otherwise still worked well enough to make a watchable TV picture) that disgusted set owners would have the screen permanently anchored in the "up" (viewing) position and the drive motor unplugged.

Space Screen 45 may not have lasted even one model year, given how very, very troublesome the sets' screen motor drive mechanisms were. I only saw one such set in my life; that was in a TV sales and repair shop in my home town in the '80s.

BTW, I wonder if there will ever be any kind of "UltraHD" or other special types of TV programming being broadcast in this country any time soon. I think today's 3-D TV is just a frill that is, at best, a warmed-over version, modified for use with TV of course, of the 3D movies popular in the 1950s, and will probably die a quiet death before too much longer (due to having to wear 3D glasses when viewing a program telecast in that format), not unlike quadraphonic (4-channel) stereo sound. I remember an article in an early-'70s issue of an electronics magazine that stated in the first sentence, in no uncertain terms, "Four-channel sound. It's tremendous! It's colossal! And it is also A BOMB!"

Whomever wrote that article was right about the third point. Quad sound systems did "bomb out" and disappeared in the early 1980s (quad FM broadcasting never did get off the ground; I don't know if Cleveland ever had even one four-channel FM station), although today's surround-sound for flat TVs is a vast improvement, with 5 or seven channels plus a subwoofer. As with Zenith Space Screen 45, I only saw one 4-channel stereo sound system in my life; that system was installed at the home of the volunteer examiner who administered my Novice class amateur radio license exam in 1972. The man has long since left the area and moved out of state, but I still remember his quad sound system, one of the first (if not the only one) in the Greater Cleveland area.

Geoff Bourquin · #15 01-16-2013, 07:29 PM

I had several customers with those Space Screen sets. All of them ate lots of those resistors on the screen/focus board (330k 1/2watt if I remember correctly). I had one where the blue CRT shattered. Luckily, they didn't have liquid cooling, so no coolant to clean up, just glass. I was always afraid one of those things was going to slam down on my head. (I know, screw drive doesn't do that without power but still....). The convergence circuit on those SUCKED! Hardly any adjustments, IIRC it was all passive, unlike some sets of the day which had several dozen convergence adjustments allowing pretty decent convergence if you spent a little time working on it. I never did think those Zeniths had a decent picture. But, it was BIG....HUGE for those days so I guess people were willing to put up with the other issues.
Last time I saw one was about 3 or 4 years ago, and it looked awful. I finally convinced the guy it was time to get something better.